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#969By Salaymeh on Wednesday, September 06, 2000 - 3:21 am

I was born as a Palestinian; My father was born as a Palestinian, and my drandfather was born as a Palestinian. ohhhhhhhh shit (sorry for the word), no no we were born as Israelis. Who said we are Palestinians!!!!!!!!!!! Sure my grand grand father was insane when he said so !!!!!!!!!! I must believe the United Nations, the whole world, and not my drand grand father, dno't you think so ??????
Let's go to the topic then:
The topic is will I be able to say I AM PALESTINIAN? or I will Just live in peace, and that is all.!!!!! So what is that shit peace then???? Ok, I mean is that peace associated with my grad father's land?
If yes or no, please tell me what is the nature of this PEACE?

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#5029By mysticsdream on Friday, February 13, 2004 - 6:54 am

PLEACE :I thought the Freudian mistake in this title was so interesting... and caught the 'homelessness'/ alienation thing .. what sort of 'peace' is there if you haave no 'place'.

Pleace...(place) what happens when you live in someone else's 'promised land'. Does their vision give you equal rights?

Pleace.. (peace) how do you live in harmony when you have cultures in war.

Pleace.. (Please) somebody come up with an equitable solution... a cry for help.

Pleace.. (police) can there be an independent body who brings law and order

Pleace.. in the histories of fathers and grandfathers my grandfather fought at Bethlehem. It was WWI .. Australia (ANZACs) was drawn into another British conflict. An inconguous place for a war, (the birthplace of Chrst) against Turks. Whose place was it. How dreadful it must be to live in an occupied land. (It was also occupied when Jesus was born.. they were called Romans.. there was to come a mass slaughter of children .. that nativity scene paints a romantic picture of what it is to be a refugee on the run from brutal oppression).

I couldn't have invented a better word than PLEACE..

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#5031By mysticsdream on Friday, February 13, 2004 - 12:34 pm

Could even be PLEA or PLEASE but whatever.. it was a touching phrase.

About the Palestinian Israel conflict my view is that people need to co-exist, that suicide bombs are not going to provide a solution, and that the USA would play a more creative role if it was less pro Zionist.

As far as I am concerned there aint no 'promised land'for Israel that justifies them purging or excluding others, (same argument for Serbia). My own 'people' are in continued transition to multi-culturalism, and we benefit from distance from the source of these conflicts, but they can resurface in the prejudices of our own communities. Though we enjoy a kind of luxurious isolationism that a super power cannot have, the down side is that we have a bad track record for being drawn into international conflicts of the super powers. All the more reason that we want people to find a peaceful solution to their problems before they escalate.

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#5052By mountainwoman on Monday, February 16, 2004 - 12:21 am

There is a song that says: You do not own the land, the land owns you. Allah, G-d, Yawheh, AllthatIs did not create Paradise so that idiot two-leggeds could contaminate it with landmines and destroy it and each other to own. I don't care WHOSE grandfather lived in Jerusalem first. If we do not learn to share and steward the land; if we do not grow in understanding, tolerance, acceptance of each other; if we do not stop insisting on our god given right to things no god ever gave us a right to -- there will be nothing for our grandchildren.
By the way, this means that you ought to be able to say that you're Irish, Chinese, African OR Palestinian and still live in peace.

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#5071By mysticsdream on Tuesday, February 17, 2004 - 12:57 pm

mmmmmm can you mail me some of those "mountainwoman feisty" pills.

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#5083By mountainwoman on Wednesday, February 18, 2004 - 2:17 am

lol - in the genes, mystics... not for sale, i'm afraid.

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#5872By Anonymous on Monday, July 05, 2004 - 12:46 am

the problem exisit as long as occupation exisit. one cannot claim authority over another just because he/she/it has the power to do so. the problem is power.. who ever think he/she/it has ultimate power is mistaken because nations cannot be ruled by power of killing and distroying. israel Or so its calledm, is an occupation force, it forced its existance on the people who do not want it... sometimes i think if the so called israel state was a better minded state maybe the people will accept it. if it will include everyone it could be better. but this so called israel state is bias,discremanaotrian...etc. i think it will not stay for so long.... a nation that think its better than other and take others homes, by forcely kicking them out of it will not stay for long even if they think so... injustice will not wine..
problem with palestine is injustice.. find JUST you will find PEACE.

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#5874By mysticsdream on Tuesday, July 06, 2004 - 5:58 am

I like the unintended error.. its poetic

Ooo the joy in Palestine
If weapons turned in a vine
And people drank
Its sacred wine.

Ooo the peace in Palestine
Forgetting what is yours and mine
To work towards a common goal
Under one God father of all.

089118530
#5875By Carlan on Tuesday, July 06, 2004 - 12:55 pm

The warring parties must wake up and become aware of where they are in the world today. They must look at whom it is that has their own true interests at heart. They must look within their own people for those people related in blood to them that can see their future filled with prosperity and comfort and safety for all of their own people. They must not buy arms and other destructive materials from people that want nothing but for them to continue buying arms and other destructive materials from them. They must separate fact from the fiction fed them from people, even people in their own culture and in their own religion that will only drag them into more and more chaos and terror. They must turn away from those countries and those people outside their borders and inside their borders that are not fully vested in making their position in the world a better healthier and a more prosperous country. They must forget the past (for the most part their past wasn’t all that good for the people anyhow) crimes and disputes and begin the building of a great society for themselves and their families. They must not believe the lies fed them that their God will promise them great glory in the mysterious world beyond death. They must know that man is the evil in the world. They must know that their religion is manufactured by ordinary men and not by some prophet or from some sacred man or woman. They must know that no man or woman has or had any more words or commands from God than what words and commands they have gotten from God themselves. Man is man and no man was ever talked to by God! Man and woman are humans and as such have got great egos and every man at one time or another has always wanted to set himself above God or at least on God’s level but it never happened nor will that ever happen. God is God and no matter how much anyone including you wants to believe that any man or woman was chosen by God to command people it never happened. Do not delude yourself or others in this wasteful thinking. Instead do as much good and do and say as many decent things as you can to make life happier and better for every one around you as you go through this earthly realm and let God do what it is that God does.

Otherwise, kill and maim each other every day and you will each earn that which you deserve and that is your family and their family members will be maimed and killed forever more!

May God’s blessing be upon each one of you!

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#5883By Albert on Wednesday, July 07, 2004 - 6:56 pm

Exactly, applies to us, too, Carlan.

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#5893By mysticsdream on Saturday, July 10, 2004 - 4:54 am

Every time I see this Freudian typo in the subject matter I shrink.. what are some of the better Freudians you guys (and mountainwoman) have made

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#5897By mountainwoman on Saturday, July 10, 2004 - 10:01 pm

Hmmm... Mystics... just went back and re-read your analysis of the typo. I think it bears repeating.

"PLEACE :I thought the Freudian mistake in this title was so interesting... and caught the 'homelessness'/ alienation thing .. what sort of 'peace' is there if you haave no 'place'.

Pleace...(place) what happens when you live in someone else's 'promised land'. Does their vision give you equal rights?

Pleace.. (peace) how do you live in harmony when you have cultures in war.

Pleace.. (Please) somebody come up with an equitable solution... a cry for help.

Pleace.. (police) can there be an independent body who brings law and order

Pleace.. in the histories of fathers and grandfathers my grandfather fought at Bethlehem. It was WWI .. Australia (ANZACs) was drawn into another British conflict. An inconguous place for a war, (the birthplace of Chrst) against Turks. Whose place was it. How dreadful it must be to live in an occupied land. (It was also occupied when Jesus was born.. they were called Romans.. there was to come a mass slaughter of children .. that nativity scene paints a romantic picture of what it is to be a refugee on the run from brutal oppression).

I couldn't have invented a better word than PLEACE.. "

The hardest hitting point you make in my opinion is when you ask WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU LIVE IN SOMEONE ELSE'S PROMISED LAND.

I think Salyameh answered that question when he|she posed his/hers...

I type for a living... I must occasionally make typos but can't recall any right now... Interesting thread starter, though...

090878060
#6051By Alexander-Rafael Suarez on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 9:41 pm

TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN:

Instead of focusing on technicalities let us get to the issue at hand. For this room to be worthwhile we should stay on-topic at all costs, not deviating outselves to the level of typos, for God's sake we have more important things to preoccupy ourselves with when it comes to this most significant & historical conflict!

I think the ideal would be the passion we may have the honor to demonstrate via debate in the context of an organized, if not more formal, social forum, properly inputting our opinions & respecting others points of views. Let me first offer my acquaintence with a little bit about my background. I have gained my notoriety via the forums, commentaries & articles of ramallahonline.com, & have contacts with the International Solidarity Movement. I also happen to be a representative of a profound movement of my own creation, which seeks just causes in the struggle for universal independence, as it is in the beginning, revolutionary & most crucial stages. I am willing to continue, if not deal exclusively with my knowledge of the conflict, but first I want to see how the respected group will respond:

In Solidarity,

Rep. Alexander-Rafael Suarez

*UNIVERSAL*PROGRESSIVE*MOVEMENT*

FOR: *DETERMINATION*OPTIMISM*-&-*NOTORIETY*

INTERNATIONAL EDUCATIONAL ENTERPRISES, INC;

http://www.webspawner.com/users/1upmmpu1/index.html

090878352
#6052By Alexander-Rafael-Suarez on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 9:45 pm

For the first question posed back in 2000 at the initiation of the forum, which was not been responded to until 4 years later. If you believe in the United Nations & the International World, then it would in no way conflict with your identity, or at least that of your grandfather. For over a half-a-century international law has defended Palestinian rights, there has been a Palestine long before the British ruled the region, the word originates from thousands of years ago, everyone recognizes Palestine, the international world especially, I do not know what gives you the idea your grandfather is not Palestinian, everyone accepts that nation, even the Zionists, it is more a question of occupation then identity...

098339919
#6962By mysticsdream on Thursday, October 21, 2004 - 6:25 am

Hehehe mountainwoman thanks for the consideration.

PS Alexander etc. my grandfather was an Aussie fighting some other countries war... in those days it was about supporting "the empire". I have no misapprehension that he fought for Australia and was Australian. In those days that imperial conflict was with the Turks.

Today the world may recognise a Palestine but we still see west bank dispossession.

Today I went walking in 'the bush'. I was asked is there another place you would consider calling home.. it was suggested that Canada nearest replicates Australia. But there is no other place for me that I could call home.

When people are driven from their place, or displaced or dispossessed, there can be a great sense of disconnection and anger. I am lucky to live in a place which is relatively secure. I'd hate to live in Palestine... a state which may be recognised, but a people who are in perpetual conflict with invaders claiming their divine right to occupy and oppress Palestinians. There can be no peace or even pleace... when human rights are denied by people claiming to be 'chosen' and acting in some sort of superiority to their neighbour... in a way which takes land and creates enemies with Palestinians. I abhor the Palestinian suicide bombers. I abhor the Israel missiles. I implore people to learn to co-exist and find alternatives to 'gun point' diplomacy.